Thinking Matters have organised some free to the public Q & A seminars at the University of Auckland.
Has Science Disproved God?
Have the discoveries of modern science proved that belief in God is irrational and untenable? Does faith hinder or inspire scientific research?
In this public Q & A event, several of New Zealand’s top scientists and Christian thinkers come together to examine the claims of popular atheists, such as Richard Dawkins, and explore the the credibility of God in the context of cosmology, biology, and physics.
The speakers are:
Neil Broom (PhD) is Professor and Head of the Department of Chemical and Materials Engineering at the University of Auckland. He was elected a Fellow of the Royal Society of New Zealand in 2008 and is the author of the book How Blind Is the Watchmaker?: Nature’s Design & the Limits of Naturalistic Science.
Jeff Tallon (PhD) is Distinguished Scientist at Industrial Research Ltd and a former Professor of Physics at Victoria University. He is internationally known for his research in high-temperature superconductors, is a Fellow of the Royal Society of New Zealand and in 2002 was awarded the Rutherford Medal, New Zealand’s highest science award.
Robert Mann (PhD) previously taught biochemistry and environmental studies at the University of Auckland and and has been on the council of the New Zealand Association of Scientists.
Matthew Flannagan (PhD) adjunct lecturer in Philosophy at Laidlaw College and Bethlehem Tertiary Institute and is currently teaching philosophy, ethics and religious studies at St Peters College. He specialises in applied ethics and the interface between philosophy and theology. He is a prominent New Zealand Christian commentator, debater and blogger.
When:
Thursday 11 March at 7pm
Where:
260-073 Owen G Glenn Building (OGGB 4), 12 Grafton Road, The University of Auckland
Mark it in your diary, check out the Facebook page and tell your friends. This event is sponsored by the Tertiary Student Christian Fellowship.
Tags: Events · Jeff Tallon · Matthew Flannagan · Neil Broom · Richard Dawkins · Robert Mann · Science and Religion · Thinking Matters18 Comments
A common objection to belief in the God of the Bible is that a good, kind, and loving deity would never command the wholesale slaughter of nations. In the tradition of his popular Is God a Moral Monster?, Paul Copan teams up with Matthew Flannagan to tackle some of the most confusing and uncomfortable passages of Scripture. Together they help the Christian and nonbeliever alike understand the biblical, theological, philosophical, and ethical implications of Old Testament warfare passages.
Neil Broom and Robert Mann? Gee Whizz!
If you want to be taken seriously I wouldn’t advertise that you wrote “How Blind is the Watchmaker”
Despite the insightful previous comment, I’m very interested. Will there be audio or video for your readers in Malaysia?
Since the only thing science can really tell us for sure is how things work in the present day, and discover laws that may simply be God upholding all things by the power of his word, there’s no way in which science can disprove God.
The most scientists could do, if they were able to create a universe and living things ex nihilo is show that what God did they can do to. Being able to replicate another’s work does not register that individual non-existent.
Somebody emailed me this. And I’m finding it challenging to my faith. Everything I’ve looked up that it cites? True. And the point about how arrogant it would be for me to pick and choose? Hard! Here, look at it:
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The Bible is the infallible word of our Lord. If you are a TRUE Christian, you follow these these commands:
Who You Should Kill
–Unruly or rebellious child. Deut 21:20-21
–Those who curse or hit their parents. Lev 20:9, Ex 21:15
–Worshipers of other gods. Deut 13:6-11
–Psychics, witches. Lev 20:27, Deut 13:6-11, Ex 22:18.
–Those who do not believe in Jesus (parable). Luke 19:27.
–Those who work on the Sabbath. Ex 35:2 (Moses kills a gentile for this. Num 15:32-36.)
–Those who are accused by at least two people of wickedness. Deut 17:6.
–The children and babies of enemies. Num 31:17, Deut 20:13, Psalm 137:9, Lev 26:29.
–Adulterers. Lev 20:10.
–Homosexuals. Lev 20:13.
–A woman who is not a virgin when married. Deut 22:13-21.
–Those who are careless with murderous livestock. Exodus 21:29.
Who You Should Hate
–Those who eat crab or shrimp. Lev 11:10.
–Those who sacrifice an animal to God that has a blemish. Deut 17:1.
–Those who remarry the same person after divorce. Deut 24:4.
–Homosexuals. Lev 18:22.
–Those who are proud. Prov 16:5.
–A woman who wears pants. Deut 22:5.
–A man with long hair (Jesus?). 1Cor 11:14
–Those who call others fools Mat 5:22
Should we still do this stuff?
–All OT laws still apply in NT. Matt 5:17-19
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You don’t dare to try and FILTER and pick and choose from the word of God right? You don’t pull that nambie-pampy “out of context” silliness with passages you don’t like, but then wholeheartedly accept those you DO like? That is SIN!
So either you are a TRUE Christian, and you’ll follow those loving commands from God. Or you are doomed to be tortured in hell forever! Oh Glory!
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Sorry Susan, you’re finding that challenging?
Rule one. God’s game, God’s rules.
As Matt pointed out in his recent Investigate column morality is whatever God calls it. If God commands it, it’s right.
As for the actual list, first remember that Christians and Jews are under different contracts. We get the Noachian laws without specified penalties.
As for the Jewish laws, do read the context. Moses put to death a man who was violating the Sabbath ruling within days of it being given. If you let that ride how long would it be before the Jews decided thieving and adultery (let alone murder) were perfectly acceptable pastimes.
Disrespecting ones parents, in a society where your children were your old age pension, destabilised the social order. Living one step away from anarchy and starvation tended to make the law rather pointed (to say the least).
The unruly child in Deuteronomy has drunkenness as one of his failings. We’re talking about a young man here (see above) and the punishment is entirely appropriate.
Israel were already prone to going after other gods, their general unfaithfulness makes up a lot of scripture. At least knowing there were penalties for going whoring gave them some disincentive. Remember what happened to Israel when they did go after other gods, God scattered them to the four winds. By discouraging false religious leaders, God was trying to avoid having to kill too many Israelites.
Two confirming witnesses were a point of law in ancient Israel. You couldn’t be put to death on the testimony of one witness, which was better than some systems where any noble who didn’t like you could have you whacked legally.
Do you think that someone who knows that their dangerous animal could kill someone should escape punishment when they do? There are some pit bull owners I’d introduce to the pointy end of a 9mm for the same reason.
Also remember that the language didn’t have many nuances. If you didn’t like something you hated it, if you liked something less than another you hated it. Everything should be hated in comparison to your love for God.
Try to read the actual passages with an eye to the actual context. The first rule of Bible reading is, any text without a context is a pre-text for a proof-text. Being a Christian means I treat the Bible as a truthful text. It doesn’t mean I become stupid.
“There are some pit bull owners I’d introduce to the pointy end of a 9mm for the same reason.”…. Yeah – um – Susan – I just don’t think you are really getting the whole Christian thing. Just quietly…
I am looking forward to this.
Wil be interesting to see if I am the only person attending with an ‘open mind’ (the usual situation) and it will merely be an opportunity for everybody to shout down everybody else, or whether some intelligent discussions will be undertaken.
@ Anonymous “Susan – I just don’t think you are really getting the whole Christian thing”
To be fair – you quote from Jason’s comment and then say Susan.
But yes I agree the remark about a pointy end of a 9mm seems a bit aggressive (albeit not out of place??). Tellingly though is the reference to A 9mm rather than MY 9mm.
Fair’s fair cj, I’d never own a 9mm, that’s not a real gun.
A Desert Eagle 50 calibre, now that’s a real gun. =)
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Susan, if you are a TRUE Christian you will follow the example of Christ primarily. Jesus was notably against pharasaical rules, and controversially welcoming of all sorts of society’s misfits. Read the Sermon on the Mount for the best summary of actual CHRIST-IAN values as opposed to a weird collection of ancient Hebrew bylaws.
Besides his stern attitude to justice, do not forget God’s kindness and grace, something that is patently lacking from your collection of laws. We serve the living God of the Book, we do not serve a mere book.
“The law brings death, but the Spirit gives life”
.-= My last blog-post ..RE: iMonk’s story about his Dad =-.
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No Way!
Surely the answer is that both science and religion are complimentary rather than at odds? They both are an attempt to define existence and the wonder that it is. Obviously both do a lousy job but are still our best attempt!